Thanks Barb and Dianne. I am addicted to anything that covers up my feelings, although currently I am not actively using shopping, eating, alcohol etc so am dealing with many painful things as they come up.
I am having new realizations about myself and relationships now, not really fun, but want to be addiction free so is worth it.
I was addicted to approval by others, but never approval of myself by me. I went to Codependents Annonymous and well as alanon when I lived in So. Calif. I realized being codependent is not easy to get over, I still am realizing more that I do, to make life difficult for myself. Would much rather please friends and dogs than even look at my needs. Then I get exhausted and upset easily. When I was married to a strong person, I had no idea what I liked. Just easier to do what ever he wanted. Today looking at the yard and asking myself, what would you like it to look like? Do you want to change to a simpler design? Sometimes doing what I am familiar with isn't best for me. If it was for you I would fix it just the way you like. Still learning to take care of my needs. It is clear if I take care of myself better, I will be more tolerant of others. I went to 12 step programs since 1980, have not gone since joined this group, but am very aware there is wisdom and support if I am more open to it. If there was a 12 step program here for hoarders I would go weekly, and am so glad I know how to apply the 12 steps to hoarding, step 1: I am powerless over hoarding and my life has become unmanageable and and by the 12th step, having had a spiritual awakening, I am able to be hoard free after doing all the foot work.

Thank you, Barb.

Your friend is very blessed to have you by her side. Even after we are well on the road of recovery it is always a day to day process.

http://al-anonfamilygroups.org/Podcasts/FirstSteps/?powerpress_pinw=519-podcast

Here is the link to an excellent podcast called Focus on Yourself from the Al-Anon website.
If you are the family member or friend of a hoarder, you might want to listen. There is no video; only audio.
Al-Anon is an organization for friends and families of alcoholics and drug addicts. Hoarding is not the same, but shares some characteristics of addiction. People who love and live with hoarders, alcoholics and addicts need to be reminded that they cannot fix the person they love and that they need to do what is necessary to care for and love themselves.
One of my very close friends fights alcoholism every day and I have found Al-Anon extremely helpful in learning how to be her friend, not her savior.

Thanks for the verse & everyones comments. I really needed them. The verse is especially appropriate. I heard once that hoarders get almost blinded or numb to our surroundings. Its the only way we can cope with the situation but because of it then the problem escalates. The lady telling me about it had a special word for it but it escapes me now.
I will utilize this verse to help change.
In recovery programs with 12 steps,they simplify the first 3 to
I can't.
God can.
Let him.
Its why I chose this name to remind me I need to Trust God & clean house. Which the 4th step of the program abbreviated down to.
When I'm feeling weak I boost myself with Phillipians 4:13 I can do all thing's through Christ who gives me strength.

I'm back from the southwest. It did me good to get away from my cluttered house for a while. I need a new perspective on life.
I very much enjoyed the pace of life in Santa Fe. It is much more relaxed than I am used to. Vacation gives you time to think about life in the present moment.
I visited Bandolier Monument where the first Native people settled in America. Their little cave houses are so small. They store only what they will need.
The Taos Pueblo houses are also small. They have only the bare necessities for life. There is no electricity or plumbing in the houses. Although, that is more primitive living than I would like, it does make me reflect on what things I could easily surrender.
I did not get to visit Earthship community. This is a modern day settlement that explores how to live simply while conserving resources. Next time I visit New Mexico, I would like to see the projects they are working on.
In my quest to learn to live more simply, I am reading Anne Wilson Schaef's daily devotional Native Wisdom for White Minds.
It is interesting to me as I read to discover that the core ideas of Native peoples are not foreign to Christianity. They are clearly expressed in the Bible. But western religion has chosen to place those ideas in the background.
Again and again I am brought back to seeking a simple faith and trying to learn day by day what it means to live out that faith in true honesty. The decisions I make each day either align with that faith or they do not. I will make mistakes. i will sometimes choose what feels good over what will do the most good in the long term. But that is all a part of growing in faith. And I am not finished growing yet.

LR so happy I just reread your post. I forget about visualizing so good reminder. I am going to visualize my bedroom organized before I go in with garbage bag and timer. It has worked in other rooms, it will work in there, just have to visualize in clean and believe change is possible. I have had a messie bedroom for as long as I can remember. Door shut.
This is difficult. Ok, trust divine inspiration will guide me, it is difficult to even imagine a clean bedroom. I just want to go do something else. I have learned to take action even when I don't want to so here I go to face the floor pile.

Diane, you said "Funny thing is my vision of clean areas was not nearly as nice as they turned out. I see this as my willingness to do the work was complemented by spiritual inspiration to make areas even better."

That is encouraging to me, because I have a hard time visualizing these days how things would look (or how I would want them to look) without the clutter. It's nice to think that even if my vision is still "cluttered," that if I'm doing the footwork, things might turn out much better than I would/could have imagined on my own. Thanks for sharing that.

Roxie I appreciated you talking about the need for a vision. I hold on to the vision of my neurotic moms people skills and now see that it is time for a new vision. I can now have a vision of peaceful interactions.
I know visualizing living area as I want it has helped, as well as yard and deck. Your post made me think I need to change my vision of remaining "hoard" rooms and garage. I have been stuck seeing them as they are, now need to see them as I want them to be.
Funny thing is my vision of clean areas was not nearly as nice as they turned out. I see this as my willingness to do the work was complemented by spiritual inspiration to make areas even better.

Enjoyed reading your posts, we all are learning so much by doing this journey together. Today I was a nervous wreck before company arrived. When she was here, I felt so much of what she said was what God would tell me. I need others in my life to experience spiritual connection, but have felt being alone is the only way to not make mistakes in relationships. Since I have experienced rejection so many times for comments I make, even on this site, I know all hurts give me a chance to forgive myself, get up and try to do better. Today I was a much better listener and carefully thought before I spoke, asking, what is my intention saying this, is it kind, will it bring us closer or push her away. I felt really good about our interaction. She later called and said how much she enjoyed our visit and again told me how great my place looks now. I think tooth pain and being reminded I can come across as harsh, caused enough misery that I am willing to work on change. I believe it is spiritual guidance to make me a more loving person to myself and others.

Wow, this is the second time in two days that I have seen the message "Without a vision, the people perish." Proverbs 29:18." To me, that means it is a message to which I need to pay attention. Thank you. /color]

LR and Diane, what both of you wrote really hits home with me. A therapist told me 40 years ago that I was trying to be *Lady Bountiful* graciously portioning out to help those lesser than myself. I was very insulted because I thought I was just trying to help others. And I surely didn't put myself above others. My self-esteem was much too low for that. But with a lot of thought I began to see that she could have been right. There's an old Moody Blues song that goes ~~ and all the love you've been giving, has all been meant for you.... That comes to mind occasionally even now.

LR, I love your comment I will do better to let God be God and let myself be a human being who understands her limitations and doesn't have an exaggerated sense of what she can or needs to do to "save the world." I need to keep that in mind.

LR I could not have said it better, I am just seeing that I too, save things, and used to buy things for others, and like the soccer ball, they may never need or want it. I appreciate your ability to say in words what it running around in my head.
Today when I was sitting in my spot, and saw my little sign that only says "trust god" it dawned on me that all the spiritual books that I never find time to read can now be donated. sitting quietly looking at that little plaque and feeling the presence and knowing I will be guided as long as I am willing is enough. I really think if I trust, I do not need to have 40 skirts, 111 books on spiritual growth, privacy screens up everywhere and all the other junk I keep to feel safe, time and time again I know all will be well if I just let go of the clutter that is blocking me from the divine in life.

I've become aware that one thing that has contributed to my clutter issue in the past is wanting to "have whatever someone else might need" if/when they need it. That is to say, if they needed a certain tool, a certain this, a certain that, I wanted to be able to say, "I have one you can use!" Whether my motives were self-centered (wanting to feel "useful") or whether I was truly wanting to be helpful, I now try to think differently. First, I know I can't truly be helpful to myself or anyone else if I can't even find the needed item! Trying to save everything in case someone needs it doesn't work very well for me or for them in the long run.

Thinking in terms of spirituality, my clutter can just be a symptom of my "save the world" mentality. Am I, in a sense, trying to play God by all this saving of physical clutter? I will do better to let God be God and let myself be a human being who understands her limitations and doesn't have an exaggerated sense of what she can or needs to do to "save the world."

Abbey,
I'm glad you posted here.
I wrote my post because it is so difficult to see beyond the clutter to what it can be. It is easier to see what is right in front of us. But we have to work at not letting that discourage us.
Hang in there. We will get there. Step by step. Day by day. Choice by choice.
Celebrate the little victories.

Hi Barb,
I wish I could stayed focused on my vision of what I want my home to look like when my clutter is gone.
But all I am able to focus on is how it is now.
But I enjoyed your post.
Abbey

Here is my Bible verse for today:

"Without a vision, the people perish." Proverbs 29:18

Sitting in the middle of chaos, I have a picture in my mind of what my house looked like when I moved in and what it will look like again. it is not easy to keep my focus on this picture, but it is essential.

Keep your eye on the prize!

Hey Roxie, I'm back now.

I miss Dave too. His insights and humor were daily brighteners.

Dave and Dianne, where are you? We (well, okay, I) need you here. Dianne, you are like a sister from another mother, and Dave, your humor lights the room. ((((Dave))) (Diane)))

A friend shared this with me this morning:
He makes everything beautiful in its time.

My prayer today is: God, help me to make good decisions.
My days are filled with decisions---little ones like when to break for lunch and what to eat; big ones like which repair estimate to accept. The important thing is to choose as wisely as I can with the information I have been given and not sweat the small stuff.
Some days, I make impulsive decisions that I later regret. Some days I am stuck in indecisiveness.
Today, with God's help, I will do what I need to do to move forward.
I am not perfect. I will make mistakes. Very few mistakes are fatal. I can learn from my mistakes and be wiser for it.
It's all good.

Thank you so much LR and Barb.

Exactly what I needed to read today.

LR, Thank you for your post. I am one who finds it difficult to shift gears when I can't do things the way I had planned or on the schedule I had planned.
There is an old gospel song that says "Make Me a Blessing Today". Life isn't about me. The world does not revolve around me. Being open to God's detours, does make life much more enjoyable. Often, I find that God needs me to just listen to someone. Not judge. Not offer advice. Just to let them know that they have been heard.
Listening and being in the moment with another human being is not a waste of time. It is a blessing.
May you be blessed today, LR.

God and "my plans"

One thing that has helped me on certain days lately (and that will help me more, I believe, if I do it more consistently), is to make plans for the day (whether they are decluttering plans or other types of plans). Then I acknowledge to God (to "a Higher Power," if it's more palatable to you to use that terminology) that my plans may not be God's plans for me for that day. I try to think in terms of making plans, but at the same time holding them "loosely." That's not to say that I want to go with every whim that hits me that might throw off my plans; that's something I have done in the past, and it often prevents me from making clutter progress. Neither do I want to go with every inclination to drop everything and run "fix" someone else's problem. That's gotten me into more trouble than almost anything else in the past: spending inordinate amounts of time, physical energy, and mental energy dwelling on and trying to fix other people's problems. That can be an "addiction" in and of itself. I need not try to "play God" in other people's lives, thinking that I have the power to fix their problems, that I alone am "their savior."

So when I say "holding my plans loosely," what do I mean? One thing it means is that if things don't work out as I planned, I don't have to jump and scream inwardly because things didn't go my way. I keep in mind that my plans might not have been God's plans for me, and I can be more inwardly at peace about the day instead of being resentful that things didn't go the way I wanted them to. I can feel like I am more "in the flow of life." I can be open to God's plans for me.

Shifting to this way of thinking is a slow process. First, just making specific plans for the day that include specific decluttering plans is new in and of itself. Remembering to turn my plans over to God is not automatic at this point. But I'm making progress.

Diane, I'm glad to hear you say, "giving up is not the answer,.." It can get very frustrating (understatement) when we look at what still needs to be done. Sometimes we don't really appreciate or even recognize all the progress we have made.

I relate to the ADHD struggles and to many of the other things you mentioned. Thank you for sharing your struggles.

You know, when we share our struggles, it can help us. But sharing our struggles often helps others as well. For instance, this morning, I started on a certain task that I originally intended to spend just a short time on (working on my floors). Once I was "rolling" with it, I wanted to keep going. (Sometimes to continue with a task longer than planned is OK and even good, but today, for me it would not have been the best thing.) Precisely because I had read about your "roof" story and had reflected yesterday about my tendency to do that same type of thing, I was able to recognize the behavior in myself today. I was able to stop that "floors" task and move onto the next thing I'd planned to do. So again, thanks for sharing. If you hadn't shared that, I might not have gotten some of the other things done that I did.

Many years ago we had a neighbor who had been crippled on one side from a stroke. One day I looked out the w indow and saw him working hard on potting some plants. I made a comment about how difficult it was and what he couldn't do. Mrs Dave immediately corrected me, saying that the issue was not what he couldn't do, but what he could do and how much he was accomplishing.

" I would like to be clear that I am using the term hoarder, and later clutterer, not to label someone who is suffering from computlsive hoarding or who has a tendency toward clutter, but rather as a shorthand way of referring to that person. I dislike the use of labels because labels are limiting and seem to obscure the potential for change that each one of us has inside of us. In using these terms, I am in no way indicating that a compulsive hoarder, clutterer, or even pack rat is the entirety of who that person is. It simply describes behaviors that impact the person's life."

Dr. Zasio, The Hoarder in You, p3, footnote.

Thanks Tillie for reminding me, hoarding is just one part of me, and that I deserve love and respect. I have been on here a year now, and still am not done, so have given up and been feeling a little hopeless. My ADHD has me jumping from project to project and not putting things away. I find lots of things to do, but when nothing gets finished, looks like I have made no progress at all. When I realized last Sunday was my one year anniversary, I decided not to go to group, cause I felt like a loser, working so hard for a year and lots of mess still.
I did get through all the pants, and only ones I can currently wear are in closet now. I worked on removing years of build up on part of the roof all last week, like a mad woman, from early morning until dark, and neglected everything else. I have all spring/summer to do that. still all or nothing for me. I am frustrated. I was feeling frustrated with others that can't "find the time" to do essential things. Then felt bad that I was so opinionated, then continued to find fault with my progress. today I reread your posts and realize your encouragement is essential to me getting back on track. Giving up is not the answer, as much as I want to recently.

You may have trouble with getting and keeping too much stuff and/or with getting the trash out and/or doing the usual house cleaning
BUT, you are all so much more than that.
The hoarding, cluttering & squalor is just one tiny little bit of the whole person that every one of you are.
You are a whole person deserving love and respect. (((HUGS)))

LR, that was a beautiful post, thank you. I needed to read that today.

I wish you were in my real life world.

I am glad we have a spot on here for spirituality.

One spiritual thought that I see some of you posting on here that is very important (but is hard for some of us to grasp at first) is that we are each valuable just as we are. I do not want to keep living with all the "stuff" I have in the past, but the changes won't happen overnight. Many of us have told ourselves a lot of negative things about ourselves through the years (and if we didn't, perhaps many others have said negative things to and about us). We may have come to see ourselves as "less than," or perhaps even "not valuable at all."

If the day comes when I have a clutter-free life, I may be able to function much better, but I won't be any more or less "valuable" than I am right now. I'm saying that as much to myself as I am to anyone else. trying to remind myself of that.

I think a beautiful example of this is one of my relatives. She was a hoarder all her life. (Runs in my family.) She didn't "want to" be like that, but she was. Now she is nearing 80, is in a highly specialized nursing facility, and can communicate only with gestures and with whispers (has a ventilator). And she is so deeply loved by me and so many people. I feel her love for me. We have a special bond, and I love to go visit her. We still "have fun," despite communication barriers. I will miss her terribly the day she leaves this earth (if that day comes before I myself leave this earth).

My relationship with her helps remind me of the truth of the things I wrote in the first paragraph. She is still a beautiful human being, hoarding and all. It reminds me that of all the things I need to discard, one of the most important things I need to throw away is the idea that I am "less than" because I have hoarding issues.